The Other Side
The Charity Freelancer's Podcast | Where Charity Experience meets Freelance Success
The Other Side: The Charity Freelancer's Podcast explores the journey from charity professional to thriving freelancer. Join us for practical tips, real stories, and community connection for anyone considering or already on their freelance journey in the sector.
Jane Curtis chats with individuals who've made the leap to freelance or self employment from the charity sector and in doing so uncovers invaluable practical tips and incredible insights first-hand.
Whether you're considering making the move or you're already on your freelance journey, or you’re just nosey and want to know what goes on behind the scenes of well known freelance businesses… you're in the right place.
The Other Side
Steve Allman - Build A Sustainable Freelance Life And Bring Hobnobs
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Steve Allman discovered the charity sector as a teenage volunteer and loved it so much he never left. Coaching charity leaders and facilitating workshops, he’s designed a freelance life that works around real family needs.
We talk about how to make self-employment work after a long charity career: what resilience looks like when you’re responsible for your own income, how to avoid burnout, and why boundaries matter more than hustle. Steve shares how he moved through different freelance phases, from saying yes to almost everything (and undercharging for years) to getting clear on an offer that plays to his strengths and protects his energy.
LinkedIn is a big part of Steve’s story. During lockdown he posted daily to tackle professional isolation, and with 45,000 followers he's now well-known for his light-hearted approach to content. We dig into how he finds ideas, why humour can validate tough truths for charity CEOs and managers, and what “being yourself” looks like when you want clients without sounding like every other beige post.
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You can connect with Steve on LinkedIn.
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If you want practical insight on freelancing in relation to pricing, workload boundaries and LinkedIn content that actually sounds human, you’ll get a lot out of this episode. Please subscribe, share, and leave a review so more charity freelancers can find us.
If you're looking to replace your 9 to 5 salary without working 24/7, check out my website where you can sign up to weekly tips to help you earn more doing work you love.
Jane Curtis, founder of The Charity Freelancing Course, host of The Other Side Podcast and Co-founder of The Rich & Restored Retreat.
Jane has spent 26 years in the charity sector, is a former events fundraiser, and now supports well over 100 charity sector freelancers to replace their in house salary without working 24/7 through a group mastermind programme, charity freelancing course and 1:1 work.
Welcome And Steve’s Story
Jane CurtisWelcome to the other side, the charity freelancers podcast. I'm Jane Curtis, and this is where we explore the journey from charity professional to thriving freelancer or business owner. Each week I chat with individuals who've made this leap from the charity sector, sharing invaluable practical tips and incredible insights firsthand. Whether you're considering making the move, or you're already on your freelance journey, or you're just nosy and want to know what goes on behind the scenes of well-known freelance businesses, you're in the right place. So put your feet up and settle in as we dive into today's conversation.
Volunteering That Started A Career
Jane CurtisSteve Allman discovered the charity sector as a teenage volunteer and loved it so much he never left. After working directly with disabled people and young people, and then as a charity CEO for seven years, Steve stepped away to prioritise his young family. He took on two to three months consultancy work until he got a proper job, but that became his proper job. And now, 14 years later, he coaches charity leaders and facilitates workshops to help people who do good do great. Steve, welcome to the other side.
Steve AllmanThank you. Thanks for having me.
Jane CurtisYeah, you're so welcome. Um I'd love to start first of all to just like find out a bit more about your charity background. So can you tell me a little bit about how and where you started?
Steve AllmanYeah, of course. So so um when I was 16, um, somebody came to my school. Um, I was in year 11 at the time, and they were talking about um volunteering with disabled children, uh play scheme over school holidays. Um and I was quite interested already, but then they said two very important things which stuck with me. And you've got to remember, you've got to remember me as a 16-year-old boy at the time. Um, they said that they were gonna pay volunteers a flat rate of £20 per day. And I thought, that sounds fantastic. So they were giving you, giving you like they called it expenses, out-of-pocket expenses. And I thought they're gonna let me go bowling and go to cinema or go swimming and have a great time, and I'm gonna get out-of-pocket expenses for it. And the second thing they said was they said, well, they really need more boys to volunteer because it was very popular with girls, and the girls outnumber the boys by 12 to 1. So I thought, well, they're two really good reasons to get involved in this in this volunteer project. Um, and so I signed up, had a great summer, um, saw the Spice Girls movie six or seven times that particular summer, which got quite boring by the end. Um, but yeah, loved every minute of it and it went from there.
Jane CurtisAmazing. And and you stayed in charity for how many years before you moved out to set up your own thing? Was it?
Steve AllmanI think it must have been um, I mean, that was the mid-90s, and I went freelance in 2012. So before then, I moved out of the volunteer and into direct support work. Um, I was working in community homes and older people's homes. Um, and then I moved into management roles. I was a youth worker for a bit, and I was in management roles, and then ultimately my longest role, um, I was uh CEO of a disabled children's charity for for about seven years and had various roles kind of sitting alongside that. So yeah, so but I I blame it all on that initial volunteering experience, which was really, really good uh and really opened my eyes to you know what's possible if you have a career in the charity sector.
Family Health And Going Freelance
Jane CurtisYeah. And we talked a little bit in that uh intro about um that you sort of stepped out to prioritize your young family. Was that the kind of drive? Do you think that was the kind of catalyst in a way of kind of then going into consultancy after, like that it fitted around family?
Steve AllmanYeah, it's it's a strange story because um I think I say that about young family, kind of gloss over what was really going on at the time, but there were a couple of things going on, and primarily um my wife and I um had a little boy who was two at the time. Um, he's about to do his GCSCs now, so that tells you kind of how much time has passed. Um, and shortly after he was born, my wife got diagnosed with cystic fibrosis, which is um uh a lung condition and quite a serious lung condition. Um, and it's the kind of thing you have since birth, but for whatever reason, they only discovered it in in adulthood. Um, and she was in hospital quite a lot. She was in a hospital 60 miles away from us. Um, we had a young, a young child. I was still trying to be a good charity CEO with all the things that come with that, all the pressure, all the evening meetings and early starts. Um, and I kind of hit this point where I realized actually it's not gonna work for our family at the time. My job wasn't gonna work. Um and and yeah, so it was either it was either the job or the child, and I quite like the child. So I thought the job needs to go. Um, and then luckily at the time, um, somebody offered me some consultancy. It was like some desk research written research for a couple of other charities, just until I I found another job in the charity sector that would kind of suit our family needs more. Um, but that consultancy just spiraled from there and became whatever it is now.
Jane CurtisAmazing. What do you think like you learned in the charity sector that has sort of helped you in your
Charity Skills, Values And Resilience
Jane Curtisworking for yourself? Like what did that what did it give you?
Steve AllmanI think all the all the things that everybody in the charity sector can relate to in terms of you know resilience, dealing with stress, dealing with uncertainty, um, all of the things that probably are relevant, whether you're in a charity or or running your own business. Um, I think for me, the main thing was I've always had a really strong sense of my values. Um, I've always had this drive to want to make a difference in whatever work I'm I'm doing. Um, so I think certainly feel like I've brought the best of my charity sector experience into my consultancy work. Um, even down to things like a lot of people comment on how practical I am. Um, a lot of people comment on the fact that I can make really complex things fairly simple. Um, you know, and that all comes from my early work, working with young people when that was just something you did every day without really thinking about it. Um, so yeah, so so I like to think that it's kind of a more of a natural regression or transition than having to kind of start from scratch.
Jane CurtisYeah, I I completely agree about that resilience piece. I think it's so important and the kind of uncertainty because it's really not it's not certain work, is it? Um never quite know what's around the corner.
Steve AllmanYeah, yeah. And for any business as well, you know, when you've got ups and downs with kind of income or cash flow and whatever it might be, you know, and you hear a lot of business owners saying, like, oh, I don't know where I'm gonna be at this year. Um, and I think, well, welcome to our world, because there's very few charities out there, especially small ones, who know where they're gonna be at. So you get you get used slightly or wrongly, you get used to that way of working, don't you?
Jane CurtisYeah, yeah, absolutely.
Designing A Week Without Burnout
Jane CurtisUm, what's a typical week in what does a typical week of work look like now in your business?
Steve AllmanWell, I'm worried if I tell you a typical week, I'm gonna sound really anal. So I'm gonna try and gloss over that and um and and try and sound like I'm a little bit more flexible about my routine and how I work. Um, but I'd say a typical week, and the two things I do, I'm a uh coach, so I coach charity leaders on a one-to-one basis. Um, a lot of CEOs, but not just CEOs, you know, directors, managers, anyone in a in a leadership role. Um, and then I'm a facilitator and I facilitate um board workshops, team workshops, strategy workshops. So I try and keep a good balance between the two. So what it looks like is I tend to be coaching um three days a week, and then I tend to do a workshop maybe um every couple of weeks. And then, as you'll know, Jane, you've got all the stuff that comes in between in terms of, you know, your admin, your um business development and and all the rest of it. Um so for the coaching, I'm fairly routine because I like to have my sessions spaced out so that I don't do sort of back-to-back meetings um of any kind. Um, but also I think it's important that all those clients get like a good quality coaching session. And yeah, I'm I'm never going to be the coach that's doing seven sessions a day or anything like that. Um, so so I think one of the things I quite like about the the weekly routine is that I've designed it to kind of move at a pace that works for me, works for my clients. Um I also I also do a few crazy things that were really hard to do in the charity sector, like take a proper lunch break. Can you imagine that? I know. I'm almost I'm almost reluctant to say it on a podcast so that everyone finds out. Um yeah, I'm just making sure that I don't kind of get back to that point that I'd reached in um when I was in charities, that you have that kind of point of overwhelm and and burnout. Um and I was there, I was there earlier in my consultancy career, to be fair. Um, but I've not really been there for the last sort of five or six years and I'm to stay that way.
Jane CurtisAnd how did you sort of figure that out? Like, was that a kind of an iterative like try something and see how it works? You said you weren't doing it right at the start of your kind of self-employed career. So did you find that you took some of the bad habits from when you were working 95 into your kind of freelance work, or were you quite kind of intentional about
Finding Your Offer And Pricing
Jane Curtisthis is going to look very different, it's gonna feel very different?
Steve AllmanYeah, I I definitely took the bad habits from my charity career into my freelance career really early on. Um and, you know, and it's a long time ago now, but I'd say that was possibly uh a big regret of what I did early on. So so in the early days, I hadn't really figured out what my what my offer was. Um and because I was a generalist, um, you know, I'd I'd kind of moved up the charity sector in leadership positions and management positions. Um, I found myself saying yes to most things, whereas some of the people who I've seen do it really well, um, they they're specialists. So they're saying, like, you know, I was a I was a corporate fundraiser. So my freelance offer is corporate fundraising, and that makes a lot of sense. You know, you've kind of you've you've kind of um made your mark. Um whereas for me, I found myself saying yes to a lot of things, and I didn't really have a very good concept of how much work was too much work, um, no concept of how long jobs would take me, no concept of fees and what I should be charging, uh massively undercharged for for years, um, to be honest. Um, so it took me a really long time to figure it out. Um, and I think over the last um, so I was trying to do quick maths. I was thinking, how long have I been freelance? It's 14 years. So over the last 14 years, I think it's gone in three phases. There was the early phase, which was the kind of like just say yes and we'll figure it out as we go. A middle phase where I settled on um writing impact reports and evaluations, which I really enjoyed. So I got to go and meet lots of um charities firsthand and talk to lots of beneficiaries and volunteers, and I absolutely loved that. Um, and then I realized that actually I get the most when I'm with people. Um, and with the impact reports, I like the research bit, but I didn't like the bit where it was just me sat at my desk for hours on my own writing reports. Um, so I redesigned things um during COVID to focus on coaching and facilitations so that every time I'm working, I'm with people, which I really enjoy.
Jane CurtisYeah, I love that. Um what have been some of the biggest challenges that you face then in your business? That
Income, Capacity And Family Flexibility
Jane Curtisyou're having to share anyway.
Steve AllmanYeah, of course. Yeah, well, I'm trying to be really honest about them. So I was thinking, what are the worst things? Uh, and I'll I'll tell you about them. I think um I think trying to get that kind of steady stream of income, you know, because let's be honest, we we want to kind of make a difference, we want to help people, but we've still got bills to pay, we've still got mortgages and that type of thing. Um, because of my wife's situation, um, you know, I'm the only one working in my family as well. So I kind of feel a bit of extra pressure to keep things moving. Um, and and that's been a challenge. So trying to keep that steady stream of income. People say, oh, it's feast or famine. Um, I can't recall a time I've ever enjoyed a feast, but I've definitely um I've definitely endured a couple of famines. Um, and to be quite honest, there's been a couple of times that um, you know, I've nearly had to rethink things and think, well, this isn't working for me. I'm gonna have to go and get that proper job after all and and leave freelance in behind. Um, but it's taken quite a long time to figure out kind of why that is, and I've got things in place now that um make that easier. Um I think the second thing has been around trying to find the right kind of work that works around my family situation. So since my wife was diagnosed with um cystic fibrosis, um, she's also been diagnosed with cancer four years ago. Um, and she's doing me extremely well at the moment, but she's had um like a lot of treatment and chemo and that type of thing. So sometimes I need to drop work um and need to be at hospital or need to be here for my son. Um, so one of the challenges has been about making sure that I'm never overbooked. Um, and that's partly where some of that stuff, that flexibility comes in, because I would hate to be in a situation where I've got to drop a load of clients or drop a load of workshops. And that's why I'm quite careful about how I space things out. Um but yeah, I think they're two of the big ones for me anyway.
Jane CurtisYeah, yeah. And um what you've been doing this a long time, you know, you're you're kind of well established. Um what kind of gives you that sort of longevity, do you think? Like what have you kind of yeah, I'm I don't want to put words in your mouth, but like what what has been sort of the secret to you kind of still doing it after all these years?
Steve AllmanI'm really funny on LinkedIn. That's it. That's all you need to be. You just need to be funny on LinkedIn. Um, tell some really, really bad jokes about the charity sector, write some silly stories. And there's there's people out there who get curious about that and then get in touch and say, oh, I didn't realise you're a coach, I didn't realise you're a facilitator. Um, you know, it sounds like you might be able to um, you know, give us a little bit of uh a good practical session. Um so so I think definitely, I think LinkedIn certainly helped um in the last five years because it's just a really good way to kind of get yourself out there and get yourself known. Um beyond that, I think the other thing that's massive for me was realizing that I don't have to work nine to five anymore. Because I did in the early days, I did for yeah, I did for years. Um I was really stuck in that kind of nine to five mentality. So I actually got to a stage where um I realized, oh, if I don't have loads of work, then I don't have loads of work. So why am I still sat at my desk gone six o'clock? Because I haven't got a deadline. But your but your brain is still set in that kind of charity mentality that you're kind of always on.
Jane CurtisYeah, yeah, yeah. It's so interesting, isn't it? Because often that is the thing that we uh we desire, you know, when we're working in nine to five to have that kind of flexibility, and then we get it, we get the flexibility, and we still kind of keep ourselves like hemors in to those kind of like limitations or or constraints, you know. I mean, I have it very much the other the other way where I feel I'm okay about finishing because I've got a daughter I have to go and fetch from school, and that kind of is my dead and I, you know, often at the end of the day, but the beginning of the day, I still get it where I panic if I'm not on my desk at 9:30. And it's so interesting. It's like this is, you know, after all these years, it's still so ingrained, you know.
Steve AllmanYeah, yeah, yeah. I I I yeah, I get it. And I I think of it as kind of an unlearning as well. I think actually there's a lot of stuff that we do um in previous roles that you then need to unlearn as a freelancer. So a lot of those little messages that we give ourselves about, as you say, Jane, like the guilt um that that can drive us or the the fear of, you know, what are people going to think if they email me at five o'clock and I don't get back to them until the next morning because I wasn't working. Um, so
LinkedIn Visibility That Actually Works
Steve Allmanthere's a there's a lot of unlearning and and rethinking that you need to do.
Jane CurtisYeah, absolutely. Um, you mentioned LinkedIn just then. So you've got you've had phenomenal success on LinkedIn. Um, it's how I know of you. Um, and you've got, I think I checked you've over 43,000 followers. Um so tell me a little bit about how that all came about, because I'm guessing people who listen will know you from there too. Um, like, was that a strategic kind of decision to become more visible on LinkedIn or did it happen quite sort of naturally?
Steve AllmanIt was a weird one because it was never really about um generating work. It was never really about finding more work, it was really about finding more connection and finding more people. So one of the things that I realized during mostly during lockdown, um, because um, you know, lockdown was tough. I mean, uh, during COVID, um all my work dried up kind of instantly. Um, and because of my wife's health, we were having to um isolate um, you know, a bit a bit more than than most. Uh, and I became and I became really quite isolated. And I realized that a big part of that was that I was professionally isolated because I don't know how other people found it, but I found that when I moved out of charities into freelancing, a lot of my old network fell away. Um, there's still people I'm in touch with now, which is which is great. Um, but I missed that kind of the old network and the people, the peers and the people that you can talk to. Um, and I never really bothered with LinkedIn because I I honestly thought it was just a glorified CV. I didn't see that there was any social element to LinkedIn at all. Um, but a couple of people had mentioned it to me. So round about um it was early 2021, um, I thought I'm gonna take this a bit more seriously um and just start to, I committed to writing a post every day. Um and some of them were long, some of them were silly, a lot of them were just daft things about charities. Um, and I'd get maybe like three likes, four likes. Um, and then a couple of months in, I wrote a post about my volunteer experience, how I'd started out as a volunteer and different and then how that had helped me shape different roles. And from out of nowhere, that suddenly got 400 reactions, which really took me by surprise. Um, and then because of that, it meant a lot of a lot more people started to see all the silly posts I was writing as well. So so it kind of came out of nowhere, but I do enjoy it. I do have quite a lot of fun with it, and and it's definitely helped in terms of that professional isolation.
Jane CurtisYeah. And you still do a daily post. Is that still what you do?
Steve AllmanYeah, yeah, I do. I'd I'd say I'm mostly daily. The only thing that's changed now is because of the way that LinkedIn's changed, obviously things like um being more responsive. It's not like a blogging platform now, is it? It's like you it's not just kind of like post and ghost, I call it. So I like to be around. So I don't generally post on days when I've got workshops because I don't see there's any point in me posting something and then ignoring it for the rest of the day. Um and then and then the other thing that's changed for LinkedIn is that it doesn't, it can show you the, it can show you posts from two or three weeks ago. And I I've struggled with that a bit because a lot of my posts were relevant to like things happening that week or that day. Um so I've had to adapt a bit, but I still enjoy it.
Jane CurtisYeah. And do you how do you come up with your kind of ideas? Oh, this is probably a really difficult question to answer, but like you they're so creative, your posts, like you really I just yeah, where where did where does that come from?
Steve AllmanI think it it's nearly all personal experiences. Um you know, when I when I kind of talk about how I got into the charity sector, so that was that was 30 years ago. Um and and if I really stop and think about it, you know, I've got 30 years of random charity things to fall back on. So what I tend to do, sometimes they pop in my head and I'm I'm I'm walking the dog, and I think, oh, wouldn't that be funny if if I wrote a post about this particular experience? Um and then I'll just make a note of it later and remember. It. So I keep a list. I do keep a list in my notes on my phone of kind of running ideas. And then the other side is I think about some of my most difficult experiences in charities. I think about some of what's, you know, what's worked best. So this week I wrote a post about um 10 traits of the best trustees I've ever worked with. And you know, and people are really interested and really engaged with that. And then other times, Jane, I just want to be daft. So I'll write a daft post about um how I helped um trustees to plan a robbery by um writing the entire plan in the board papers because nobody ever reads the board papers, so the police didn't know where to look for the plan. Um and that's just my weird humour coming out more than anything.
Jane CurtisAnd there was something about biscuits. Cara told me, who I work with, told me I had to ask you something about charity biscuits or something.
Steve AllmanYeah, look, I've got my I've got my mug, I've got my Keep Calm and Eat Hobnobs mug. So yeah, I wrote a post quite early on. I wrote a post about um what your biscuit tin says about your charity. And you know, it's just a list of all the biscuits um and and what they all mean. Hobnobs means that it's you're like the best charity because that just happens to be my favourite biscuit.
Jane CurtisUm but it's got a picture behind you as well, be a chocolate hop.
Steve AllmanYeah, yeah, be a chocolate hobnob. I might have gone too far on the hobnob branding. But then what happens is because I bang on about hobnobs so much on LinkedIn. So yesterday I did a workshop um in Peterborough, I was doing a staff conference for a charity there and about 50 people. Um, and uh the CEO very kindly um brought me a packet of hobnobs to start the conference. So I like to think of myself as a bit of a you know, uh, if if you kind of like those those pop stars that have got these riders, and they say, I'll only do it if I've got like 10 white lilies and three bottles of champagne. I just want some hobnobs, that's it.
Jane CurtisGreat, easy, easily pleased. Um and um the one thing that I just wanted to reflect to you about your posts is that um I I and I was talking to Michelle Benson just um a few weeks back, who's also had a lot of success on LinkedIn. And I think what you both do so well is you almost kind of you make light of something which can be really quite serious, you know, like you but you do it in s in a way where you're not kind of taking the piss or like you know, like you're just it's almost like you're kind of validating the difficulties um and giving permission to kind of laugh at it a little bit, you know. And I I think you both do that so so well. So I just wanted to sort of commend you on that. I think you kind of give yeah, it's like a permit you give permission almost for people to feel, you know, and be kind of a bit more open about some of those things that we all know that are going on behind closed doors. So um yeah.
Steve AllmanYeah, and yeah, thanks for that. I think I think yeah, Michelle's
Humour, Honesty And Taboo Topics
Steve Allmangreat. Uh, I love Michelle's cartoons, uh, you know, I think they're fantastic. Um, but yeah, I I think when I'm thinking about LinkedIn posts and thinking about what to write, I often think back to some of my most difficult times. And they and at those times I think actually, I didn't think I could talk to anyone. So if you think about being a charity CEO, for example, a lot of the time if you're in a difficult situation, like let's say that you're um struggling to build a good relationship with your chair, or you're struggling to um motivate the team, you know, there's something going on. A lot of the times you think you're the only one. You think, you think, well, it's just me. It must mean I'm really crap at my job. It must mean I'm getting it all wrong. Um, you know, and now I'm kind of so far down the line. I've had enough conversations with charity CEOs to know that most people go through that. Um, but they can't write about it on LinkedIn because they've got their board and their boss and their colleagues to worry about. Um, but I can because I can say it and no one's gonna jump on me and say, well, I'm a bit worried about your LinkedIn posts. So I kind of feel a moral obligation, shall we say, to say the things that people find difficult to say.
Jane CurtisNo, that's great. And I bet you get loads of DMs of people just saying thank you for saying that, because I'm sure it, you know, it's very much resonates, you know.
Steve AllmanYeah. Yeah, I do. And it's quite nice. It's quite nice when people do that because you know that they've they feel seen, and quite often that's the only contact we ever have. But it's nice to think that was enough for them to think I'm not on my own with this, somebody else sees it or gets it.
Jane CurtisYeah, yeah. So it's something that you really enjoy doing, um, and it has been now um a very useful part of your business, I guess, in terms of kind of creating that pipeline and getting new clients. Is that what you're kind of finding? Um, you you, as well as followers and and kind of awareness, you're also getting clients from it.
Steve AllmanYeah, I I definitely, yeah, I mean, most of my clients are uh charities I've worked with before, um, if they're completely new to me, they've usually found me on LinkedIn. Um and yeah, and it I mean it is helpful. I think one of the challenges that I do have, Jane, if I'm quite honest, is that I've uh there's a limit to there's a limit to how many hours I have in the week. So because I'm only doing coaching and facilitation, obviously I've only got so many coaching sessions, I've only got so many workshop opportunities. So it's not like I've got like an online course or anything like that to direct people to. So one of my challenges with LinkedIn for the last couple of years has been it can sometimes generate uh it can sometimes generate interest that I can't handle. And I and I've I've struggled with that a bit. So it's it's unusual. I might talk about coaching and facilitation, but it's unusual that you'll see a post from me saying, you know, I I am a coach. Um, I have capacity for more clients. Um because I think thanks to LinkedIn, I'm I'm lucky I've got kind of a steady stream of people who want to work with me, which I'm really, really pleased about. Um, but sometimes I I do open LinkedIn and I've got some days I've got 20 DMs on LinkedIn, and I'm going through thinking, I don't do that, I can't help with that. Um, you're not
LinkedIn Tips For New Freelancers
Steve Allmaneven a charity, you know. There's um and I do struggle a bit with the kind of the meeting the expectation when you've got such a big audience.
Jane CurtisYeah. Yeah, I can imagine. Um, and for somebody who perhaps doesn't have any presence on LinkedIn, but is thinking about going in freelance or have just started, you know. I mean, I I think it's a great platform. I absolutely love hanging out there. I think I find it yeah, an awesome place. Um I've curated it in such a way that the algorithm is, yeah, it works for me. But um, but what would your advice be for anyone who's looking to kind of grow their audience on there? Do you have any tips?
Steve AllmanYeah, certainly. Well, my first tip would be um go and have a look at Michelle Benson's profile into one of her courses, and she can buy me some hobnobs later. Because I think Michelle's really got a good handle on the the technical side of LinkedIn and how it works, which which I don't. So, in terms of the writing side, I mean, I would say just, you know, be be yourself. I think that's most important. You know, there's so many, there's so many kind of beige LinkedIn posts, and they're kind of, you know, I'm thrilled to announce, I'm delighted to say. Um, and I get why people do it, because they're conscious about other people watching and what will they think and and um that type of thing. But I think it's really important to be be authentic and be yourself. So I always say, look, just write how you talk. I'd like to think how I'm talking to you now sounds similar to how I write on LinkedIn, um, because I think it's important that you just authentic, write how you talk. And also the the stuff that you think is completely irrelevant. You know, the stuff that you forgot about five years ago could be somebody else's kind of best lesson or the most support they've ever felt. Because to you, you do all the time, or you've thought about it lows, and it's old news. Whereas there's a lot of people on LinkedIn who are hearing it for the first time, reading it for the first time, and it can carry a real kind of weight that you don't realise. So I'd encourage anyone that wants to give it a go, I'd say, go for it, be yourself. Um, and don't worry if nobody sees it for three weeks, because I think that's more to do with how LinkedIn works now than anything else. And it'll yeah, it'll get to the right people eventually.
Jane CurtisYeah, you never know if you're lurching as well. You know, it might not be might not be liking and engaging in that way, but um are still seeing it. So brilliant. Um with the benefit of what you know now, what advice would you give yourself at the start of your self-employed career?
Steve AllmanUm, if I was doing it now, I would I would be clearer about my offer much earlier on. I had a lot of I had a long time when I was out there as a charity consultant, which is massive and it's really broad. And I didn't make it very clear how I can help people because I wasn't very sure how I could help people. I was still figuring it all out. It got a bit easier when it moved to evaluations and impact reports. Um, but yeah, so I think it's really important if you're starting now. I think it's um it's kind of products and services and getting clear about your offer. Um and I think the other thing I found as well, a lot of consult a lot of new freelancers, they they tend to think very short term because I think in charities we have a short-term mentality. You know, we're always looking at funding for the next 12 months. You know, if you get a year's funding, that feels like a hundred years in a charity. Um, and I think that's uh that's an unhelpful thing to bring with you into to freelancing. So I tend to be thinking about um I tend to work on the basis that the next six months will sort itself out in one way or another. I'm always thinking about six months' time, six months ahead. Um, and that's really changed the nature of how I how I work, and it's given me that kind of um that steady flow of of work, which I think you you really need. Otherwise, you just spend your whole time chasing around trying to find, you know, trying to pay next month's bills. And it's you it's just not a very relaxing way to work. It just creates more stress than you need.
Jane CurtisIt's not very pleasurable, is it? Um what you're saying about working out what your offer was, that it reminded me of something that Rob Wood said to me a long time ago, which is uh the riches are in the niches, because in America they say niche, not niches. Yeah, of course. So it doesn't work in the Brit in British, but um the riches are in the niches. Doesn't sound as good. But yes, absolutely that. Um and before we finish up, I'd love to get your kind of uh your your thoughts on like what
What’s Next For UK Charities
Jane Curtiswe're gonna see in the charity sector in the next year. I know you're not a fortune teller, but like what yeah, can we be yeah, be Mystic May again?
Steve AllmanBe mystical balls. Yeah, imagine. I don't I don't know. I mean, who knows? It's um you know at the moment, it feels like every every week we're we're going in a completely different direction to what we thought the previous week. So um it's a tricky one. I think I think a couple of things that that I've really noticed lately um is firstly, I think we're gonna see a much more vocal small charity sector. So, you know, so I'm I'm really interested in that. You know, small charities, as we know, they're the they're the majority of charities. Um, you know, we seem to kind of put them in this category that they're the they're the unusual ones. Um, but certainly if social media is anything to go by, I think we're I think we're seeing small charities kind of find their voice, which I think is really important. So that's uh that's a good sign. Um without getting too stuck into the politics. I mean, we've got elections looming. Um I'm having lots of conversations with um generally charity leaders at the moment about kind of what that what that means for them locally, and depending on which colour council you end up with, what's the impact on the charity? Um yeah. Have I been polite enough about that, Jane? Have I been diplomatic enough about that?
Jane CurtisThat line, very well.
Steve AllmanSo I think that's that's that's one to that's one to watch. Um and I think the other thing that I'm quite interested in is I'm seeing a lot more people leave the charity sector or leave working in charities to to go freelance, um, you know, which is which is great. I think I I often joke in like the same five years' time, we're gonna be loads of charity coaches with nobody to coach because there won't be any charity leaders working in charities, they'll be coaches. Um so I think that's a big change. But I think what that says is that I think it sends a message about the sector. And for me, it makes me worry about the charity sector. You know, uh, is it sustainable as a job, you know, as a as a as a career? Um, are we doing enough to make sure that people in charity jobs are being looked after, that they're not going to burn out, that they've got a good sense of um, you know, workload, boundaries, that kind of thing. And I don't believe that that comes from the individual. Um, you know, I think for me it's more about organizational resilience and charities and boards being able to structure their charities in such a way that people can kind of survive and thrive in their charity jobs. So I think that's uh that's a big change that I'm seeing at the moment. And I'm interested to see where that all pans out over the next 12 months.
Jane CurtisYeah, it is an interesting time, isn't it? Because we're kind of post-COVID now where everything kind of went really flexible and remote. And um, and it I you know, you can almost see now where organizations are telling their staff they need to be back in person and and back in offices. And I I don't know, I get a sense that a lot of people are like, well, hang on a minute, we don't need to be, you know, um doing that. So yeah, I think it's really interesting to see where that takes us.
Steve AllmanUm yeah. Watch this space.
Where To Connect And Closing
Jane CurtisUm how can people listening get more of you? I'm assuming just go to LinkedIn. But tell me, what what else have you got? What how can they find out connect with you?
Steve AllmanUh have I mentioned I'm on LinkedIn, Jane. I can't remember. Yeah. Do you know LinkedIn is my only form of social media. I don't do anything else, not even personally, don't even have any personal accounts or anything else. So wow. No, no. Um, so yeah, so it's so um I'm all in on LinkedIn, so that's the best place to find me. Um, I've got a terribly out-of-date website, which one of these days I will get around to updating. Um, there's nothing very exciting going on there, to be honest. I think LinkedIn is still the best bet. Um, yeah, and I've got my contact details on there. If anyone wants to drop me a line about anything I've said um or ask any questions, and I'm quite happy to hear from people through LinkedIn or by email.
Jane CurtisMaybe they've got an idea for a new LinkedIn post that you could uh maybe. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Steve AllmanI get some of those as well. I do get I do get DMs with anonymous posts when people say, I'd really like to say this, but I can never say it. Um Do you ever post them on their behalf? I do sometimes, as long as it's not um targeting individuals. You know, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna post an anonymous post about somebody's boss or board. Um, but if it's broader, if it's about kind of a wider issue in the sector, and someone says, I'd love to talk about this and I'd love to see what people think, and then quite often I'll I'll do it on their behalf and they keep an eye on the comments.
Jane CurtisYeah, nice. I love it. Um great, thank you so much. Thank you for joining uh today. And um yeah, we look forward to following you more on LinkedIn, seeing what you're going to be saying tomorrow.
Steve AllmanOh, thank you, Jane. And yeah, thanks for having me. It'd been really good talking to you and also finding out more about the podcast and find out more about your work as well. So thank you.
Jane CurtisThank you, Steve. And that's a wrap on another episode of The Other Side. If you enjoyed this episode, please consider sharing it with a colleague who might be thinking about their own freelance journey or leave a review. And if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe so you don't miss any future episodes. You can find all the links and resources we mentioned today in the show notes. If you're looking to replace your 9 to 5 salary without working 24-7, check out my website janecurtisevents.com, where you can sign up to weekly tips and tricks to help you earn more doing work you love. That's janecurtisevents.com. Until next time, keep exploring what's possible on the other side.